Citations in footnotes use (in text) citation format instead of footnote format. Help?

EndNote EndNote How To
1

Hi all,

I’m using: Mac OS X.6.4, Word 2008, Endnote X3.

I’ve been using Endnote for a year or so now, but have not tackled Cite While You Write until now, choosing instead to just copy citations from the preview window for my footnotes, and then exporting the nessesary references as text for my bibliographies.  The first hurdle in my way of using CWYW is that inserted citations in my footnotes only seems to use the in-text citation format: (author year) for Chicago 15th A.  This would seem to contradict the default setting for Chicago, which has “using footnote format” selected for “format citations in footnotes” in the Footnotes>Templates sections of the style settings.

I don’t ever use in text citations, but if I did, I assume Endnote would know that the citation was in the body of the text and use the citation format.  When I insert a citation into a footnote or endnote, shouldn’t it know that it’s not the body, and format the citation accordingly?

The footnote formatting for Chicago seems to be the same as the bibliographic formatting, but I would plan on changing this to something in between an in text citation and a bibliographic reference.  As I understand it, a record should have three distict templates, something like:

(in-text) citation: (Author date)

footnote citation: Author, “Title,” (Year).

bibliography: Author, “Title,” review of Reviewed Item, Journal Volume|, no. Issue |(Year)|: Cited Pages|.

Can someone correct me if my understanding is incorrect, and or tell me how I can get the results I want?

Thanks!

2

It depends on what is required by the place you are submitting the manuscript and their instructions.  If they say Chicago 15th A, then that is what the output style reflects (see here). If you have alternative instructions, then you will either need to modify that or another style from one of the other 4500+ styles (:wink:, it is usually easier to modify it if you don’t have a specifically named style!) that reflects what you want. You may want to download the most recent style of that name.  You can most easily access the webpage from the Help menu >Web Styles Finder option in the Endnote program.

The Chicago Style I have (ENX4) doesn’t seem to have a “citation” in text template (it is blank) and the footnote version is a bit shorter and different from the Works Cited templates. 

3

Leanne,

I think you’ve misunderstood my question.

I used Chicago 15th A as an example.  In truth, my dissertation is in Chinese, and requires a style that is not among the 4500+ styles available, so I’ve modified Chicago 15th A to make my own style. 

This seems to me to be irrelevant, however, as Endnote’s behavior regarding footnote citations doesn’t seem to agree with what is explained in the help section.  For testing, I’m just using a test document in English, and selecting Chicago 15th A as my style.

As you say, Chicago 15th A, does not seem to have any in-text citation templates; this is the same in X3.  I tried creating one just to see what that would do (saved the style as “Chicago 15th A alt”), and it doesn’t seem to affect the format of in-text citations at all.   I’m not sure why this is, but I don’t think it concerns my question, as I’m trying to use footnote citations.

There are sections for Citations, Bibliography, and Footnotes in the style properties dialog.  It’s the templates in the Footnotes section that should determine the format of citations in footnotes, at least according to Endnote help:

According to the help section “Citing References in Footnotes and Endnotes  (Microsoft Word)”

To cite a reference in a footnote or endnote:

1.Use the appropriate command in Word to create the footnote or endnote. (EndNote does not create the footnote or endnote in the document, but is used to insert and format citations in the note.)
2.Position the cursor in the footnote or endnote where you would like the citation(s) to appear.
3.Insert the citation as you normally would.

The EndNote style that is selected when you choose Format Bibliography determines how citations in footnotes and endnotes are formatted. EndNote can format these citations as brief in-text citations or like complete references in the bibliography. It can also create a special format specific to footnotes or endnotes, including options like “Ibid.” and other variations of shortened references when a citation appears more than once in the footnotes or endnotes. See Bibliography and Footnote Templates.

It’s this functionality (see bold underlined part) that seems to me to be, well, disfunctional.  For a start, I’d just like to get Chicago 15th A to behave the way I undertand it should.  Under the footnotes section of the Chicago 15th A settings, there are templates that seem to be identical to the bibliographic templates, that is much more information than (Author Year).  Also, the option to Format citations in footnotes: “same as bibliography” is selected from the dropdown menu.  So why are my footnote citations still using the (Author Year) format?

4

Can you please attach your modified style? It will be easier to figure out if I can look at the settings. 

thanks,

5

I really really appreciate you trying to help, but I don’t think my modified style is relevant to this question.  My question is about Chicago 15th A (for now:smiley:)  I only mention my style as it’s my eventual goal.  Right now, I’m only trying to figure out Chicago 15th A (unmodified).  If I can figure out why Chicago doesn’t appear to behave the way I think it’s supposed to, then I’ll test my own style.

So once again, my question is not about my modified style, it’s about Chicago 15th A, and how it handles citations within footnotes.  So please just check the settings for Chicago 15th A.

6

Well, it would be easier to tell from the style and compare it to mine which doesn’t behave as you say, but from this statement, I suspect that the settings have changed and it should state: “using footnote format” and not “same as bibliography”".  Perhaps if you start with the clean Chicago 15th A output style from the website (which appears to have been last updated 5-13-2010) it may work as you expect?  Again, ensure the manuscript is using the style you think it is, as it doesn’t automatically use the one showing in the endnote program. 

 

@longmemory wrote:

Also, the option to Format citations in footnotes: “same as bibliography” is selected from the dropdown menu.  So why are my footnote citations still using the (Author Year) format?

7

I just thought of something else.  I tried testing the MLA style instead of Chicago 15th A.  It seems like a better candidate to learn with, since it actually has different templates for 1) Citations (in text); 2) Bibliography; and 3) Footnotes.  They are as follows for a journal article:

Citations: (Author| Cited Pages)

Bibliography: Author. “Title.” Rev. of Reviewed Item. Journal Volume| Issue| (Year)|: Pages|. Print|.

Footnotes: Author, “Title,” Journal Volume|.Issue| (Year)|: Cited Pages|.

(I’m just copying these here for your convienience.  They are just the standard unmodified MLA style settings, so you may want to check for yourself in Endnote).

As you can see, the citation template is shortest, and is the same for all reference types I assume.  The bibliography template is the most complete, and the footnote template is somewhere in between, which helps keep the length of footnotes to a minimum.

But when I insert a citation in a footnote in word with MLA selected as my output style, the same darn thing happens.  The citation is formated as (Author Year)!!

8

@leanne wrote:

Again, ensure the manuscript is using the style you think it is, as it doesn’t automatically use the one showing in the endnote program. 

 

 

YESSSSS!  This was the answer I was looking for.  (Don’t see where you mentioned it in your first post though).  In Word, select “Format Bibliography” from the toolbar or Tools menu, then make sure the output style you want is selected from the dropdown menu here.  I completely assumed that Word would just use the style I had selected in Endnote.

Making this change makes the functionality I was testing perform just like I thought it would for standard styles like Chicago and MLA, so I should now be able to modify my own to do what I want it to do.

Thanks for your patience!

9

:smileyvery-happy: – I usually say it, but don’t think I did in this case in an ealier posting of this thread!  Starting a new document USED to use the Endnote selected style, but now it seems to have some other method for guessing what style we want to use for a new document.  – I think it might be the last one used, but I am not sure.  It does drive me crazy to have to check and change this setting when I start a new manuscript, which rarely goes to the same place as my last one did!

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